Donald Trump's lawyer spent Tuesday grilling the ex-president's former "fixer," Michael Cohen, about his role in an alleged hush money scheme and the subsequent false business documents prosecutors say were created to hide it.
Trump faces 34 felony counts around the matter — and two former prosecutors say his guilt was proven before Cohen even took the stand.
Speaking on"The Cafe Insider Podcast," Joyce Vance and Preet Bharara honed in on the falsification of documents
"Even before Michael Cohen took the stand, they had pretty much proved beyond a reasonable doubt that these documents were false records," said Bharara. "And to put a fine point on it, Cohen testified ... 'I created a document called an invoice.'"
Cohen would send invoices for the reimbursement of money he paid to adult move star Stormy Daniels, and both Trump and the Trump Organization would pay it, he said.
It was registered as lawyer fees.
Cohen was asked whether there were "services rendered" for which he was requesting payment.
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"No, ma'am," testified Cohen.
Bharara argued the reason the documents are known to be false is that the payment for Cohen could have been made in a lump sum, but CFO Allen Weisselberg and Trump decided to space it all out over time and call it a "retainer."
"So, that's just the sixth or seventh way in which prosecutors, I imagine, in summation, 'It was just B.S. Nothing was done in January, February, March, April. All those future months," he continued. "There was no reason to do that unless you were trying to cover up the nature of the expense."
Vance agreed, saying that there wasn't even a speck of reasonable doubt that the invoices were made to look as if they were for legal services rendered.
While Cohen said that the records were false, Bharara argued that other witnesses had already proven it.
But the expert said the witness did identify some things that he called "less corroborated."
Among the things on that list are conversations that Cohen said he had with Trump that were not recorded. One of those is a comment from Trump that ties the false documents to the 2016 election. Cohen claims that Trump told him if he could delay until after the election, it would be better because, if he wins, it will be irrelevant — and if he loses, he won't care.
Those conversations can't be confirmed, though what was said matches other testimony.
Stormy Daniels, for example, testified that she was pressing to have the deal made before the election, saying that after the vote, she lost her "leverage."
Vance explained that there are many legal analysts who believe Cohen shouldn't even be on the witness list, but she agreed with the strategy to corroborate as much of what Cohen says as possible.
"So, then, instead of asking jurors to take a leap of faith on believing him, they're asking jurors to take a couple more steps in a straight line," she said.
Listen to the full podcast here.